Zone 1 2010 : Rules & Registration

[geofftech]

I believe it was Starkey and Jamie who last year finished by running from High St Ken to Earls Court and then catching a train to West Kensington.

Ok.. so I'm assuming that they were heading west on a Circle and had just HSK and Earl's Court left to do, and so the went up from Gloucester Road to HSK and rather than wait for the Wimbleware down, they went on foot to Earl's Court and got the first train out - no matter what it was, which was a westbond stopping at West Ken.

Which to me, says that they've made the effort to get to Earl's Court (on foot/bus), and they've departed on a train from it, so it's 'done' the moment that that trains starts to pull out and leave - so yes, I'd still time it as the Earl's Court departure moment.

So using that logic, their time from last year is now faster by a couple of minutes! Right?

[jonny]

I have to say I agree with Geoff on the logic here - it's something I've often considered myself - but I think for the sake of keeping the rules 'as per GWR' we should continue to say that you have to travel on to the next station and end there.

However, if I were to write the rules for GWR I would say that you have the possibility of stopping the timer the moment the doors close at the final station, as that only seems logical.

You could also extend this to challenges such as the All Lines Challenge, which would affect both your start and finish times.

[scrxisi]

I can see the logic on both sides of the argument, but this is all based on an argument that Guinness "haven't considered finishing by departing from a station". I'd argue that by phrasing the rules as they have, i.e. that you finish when you set foot on a platform, they have rather effectively and somewhat cunningly outlawed finishing on a departing train (or starting on an arriving train for that matter). Why have two rules saying "you must stop your watch when you set foot on a platform" and "you can only finish by arriving at a station by tube train" when the first rule happily does it all in one? Guinness have, as I noted above, clarified this before in any case.

This is a silly argument really, as at the end of the day, Z1 day can have whatever rules the organisers consider important to make the day run well. It's a somewhat traditional and accepted practice to use Guinness rules wherever possible, and my opinion is that we stick with the previous interpretation of that rule - meaning Jamie and Starkey were correct to go one stop upon arriving at Earls Court last year.

[jonny]

Without reading through the entire thread again to double check my facts, I don't think anyone is disputing the interpretation of the Guinness Rule, we seem to all accept that on a full network attempt you *have* to finish on an arriving train.

I would just say that Guinness ought to reconsider that rule (if doing so wouldn't upset the record tables) because it's illogical - the question is why do they want to outlaw finishing on a departing train? It seems completely unnecessary to me.

As I said, I agree that we should stick to the Guinness rules where possible on the Z1 day, I was just discussing the 'validity' (for want of a better word) of the Guinness ruling

[Soup Dragon]

Whilst I agree 100% with Geoffs logic I think the problem is that if we now start to accept different rules for Z1 day then this will potentially undermine existing times that people have set. And once you do it for Z1 why not do the same rule for all other challenges? I know that alternative challenges are just a bit of fun and not like a GWR, but in order to be consistent we need to stick to the rules that have been adopted by the majority of challengers over the past few years.

[Starkey7]

This would drastically change the All Lines Challenge.

Geoff, you're sort of correct. But we actually had left the whole bit from Bayswater to Earls Court until the end. On getting to Bayswater, we again ended up on a Circle train, and rather than waiting around for a Wimbledon train at High Street Kensington, we ran (through Boots!) to Earls Court, and then took any train - to West Kensington, as it happened.

Olympia would have been an even cooler finish.

[tubeguru]

... at the end of the day, Z1 day can have whatever rules the organisers consider important to make the day run well.

I think this more or less sums up the answer to all the anal arguments that we have every year.

[hwolge]

Just dropping a line to announce mine and Patrick's return to London to try to win the Cup a third time (making it permanent). I 'm also planning to attend the final round of R15 on the Saturday (alas, Patrick is not available for that event).

Looking forward to seeing you all!

/Håkan

[greatkingrat]

As long as the ash has cleared by then!

[hwolge]

Actually, I'm hoping to pass Heathrow on my way to Miami on a business trip this Saturday, so I'm monitoring the ash situation carefully... And it's looking reasonably promising. My guess is that both Heathrow and Copenhagen will be open from Thursday and on.

[Edgemaster]

Thursday! You're even luckier than that (maybe - if flights are not too jammed with delayed people)...

[hwolge]

Thursday! You're even luckier than that (maybe - if flights are not too jammed with delayed people)...

Supposedly, all major airlines honour existing reservations rather than clearing the backlog. The cancel victims will have to wait for openings (worst case a week or more for an Atlantic crossing).

[Starkey7]

I would imagine that they would lay enough extra flights on to clear the backlog; existing bookings aren't normally affected.

[RichieG]

I would imagine that they would lay enough extra flights on to clear the backlog; existing bookings aren't normally affected.

I thought that as well, but given how much backlog there is, and that there is a finite amount of available flight paths and planes themselves, they wouldn't be able to put on that many extra flights really I don't think. Admittedly, I'm not an aerophile so don't really know these things properly!

[Soup Dragon]

From the point of Air New Zealand we will have cleared our backlog of passengers and cargo by tomorrow 23rd April. We put on three extra flights to get things moving quickly.